Hacking wifi networks [Archive] - MX5 Miata Atlanta Owners Club

Bob_Bobber0

10-21-2011, 08:13 PM

Yea so, I'm too cheap to actually pay for internet (that and I think the companies are ridiculous and try to rape you of money).

For the last two months I've been using my phone (rooted and using a free wifi tether app) for internet. But I stumbled upon a program called Backtrack that allows you to hack wifi connections (WEP/WPA2). I followed a pretty basic and simple tutorial on youtube and now I'm using a local auto-dealerships secured wifi connection..

Should I be concerned legally about using this connection? Any way to trace me?

NA6R

10-21-2011, 08:17 PM

caseyfoster

10-21-2011, 08:53 PM

If you really want to fly under the radar, look through the settings on the router, find a common theme of the computer names on the network, make yours similar to that and the IT guy wont think twice.

Bob_Bobber0

10-21-2011, 09:38 PM

Yea I got into the router, lol blank username and password admin, default stuff. I'm assuming its not professionally managed. I couldnt find a list of users though, I'll keep searching. Pretty fun stuff though..

Stealth97

10-21-2011, 10:31 PM

Highly doubtful you'd ever get caught, but what you are doing is illegal.

FooSchnickens

10-21-2011, 11:07 PM

This ^

91LudeSiT

10-22-2011, 12:40 PM

In the state of GA the punishment for what you are doing is up to 25 years in prison, just FYI. I have a background in IT security. What you are doing is most certainly traceable, and very easily. You'll need to do some mac cloning to hide yourself, but long story short, don't break the law.

jester911

10-22-2011, 02:07 PM

Making an admission of it on a public forum isn't advisable either.

miatasaint

10-22-2011, 02:22 PM

Making an admission of it on a public forum isn't advisable either.

Just thinking the same thing...

subspeed6

10-22-2011, 05:23 PM

This is a really bad idea for multiple reasons that have been said and a few that haven't.

Not only that, but AT&T DSL is only 14.95 a month. That is like 2-3 beers at a bar. I can understand being cheap, but really?

Bob_Bobber0

10-22-2011, 05:27 PM

It was more of a "lets see if I can do this" kinda thing. But I've had my fun, I'm just gunna go ask my neighbor for her password lol.

And ANY kind of setup from any local cable provider (charter or At&T) with any decent speed 6 mbps+ requires a $150 install fee if you don't bundle and get some of their other overpriced crap. Toss in the $100 modem fee, and $50 new customer fee and its over $300 to just get the initial setup, and then another $30+ a month for service.

Perhaps I don't live in the real world.

Stealth97

10-22-2011, 05:51 PM

Well, if the possible consequences are worth it to you, then of course by all means continue.

Dr.Drew

10-22-2011, 08:20 PM

Yea so, I'm too cheap to actually pay for a car (that and I think the car companies are ridiculous and try to rape you of money).

For the last two months I've been using my public transportation. But I stumbled upon an item called slimjim that allows you to break into cars. I followed a pretty basic and simple tutorial on youtube and now I'm using a neighbor's car..

Should I be concerned legally about using this car? Any way to trace me?

Honestly, I wouldn't worry about it as long as you're not doing something that uses some stupid amount of bandwidth. Of course it's only a matter of time before some news networks runs a special about how we're all being robbed blind by people stealing our internets and then everyone will freak out and judges will start "making examples." But until then, **** it, go for it.

amaff

10-22-2011, 08:46 PM

Bob_Bobber0

10-22-2011, 08:57 PM

I didn't do anything illegal. Just tested the security strength of the network for the people. Turns out its not very secure. Lol.

Drew your example is perfect.

Also it must be a residential household's internet because there are no car import places within a the range of a wifi connection. Still trying to find out where or why they would name it like that. Drove around the neighborhood you would be surprised with the amount of WEP encrypted (and just unsecured) networks.

I wonder if there'll be some kind of epidemic of people just driving around hacking poorly secured networks. Tempted me for a bit but I don't know anything about it and would rather not spend my life in prison for hacking..

Dr.Drew

10-22-2011, 09:03 PM

:lol: well tell ya what. You get away with that excuse and I'm gonna start testing the security at several places, mainly HHGregg and Jim Ellis Porsche

Bob_Bobber0

10-22-2011, 09:09 PM

Haha, I'm sure anything worth "testing" has pretty secured networking options. Look man I just wanna watch netflix.

I dont know how this idea didn't occur to me before like two days ago. Anyone can do this its ridiculous.

780racer

10-23-2011, 09:20 PM

FYI i worked for a company that used to manager and support at least 70-80ish% of corporate wifi, and we used MAC biased authentication. Just an FYI.

Bob_Bobber0

10-24-2011, 08:48 AM

FYI i worked for a company that used to manager and support at least 70-80ish% of corporate wifi, and we used MAC biased authentication. Just an FYI.

Thats the most secure connection type correct? It just allows computers who match those predefined serial #'s to connect?

amaff

10-24-2011, 08:57 AM

Sure. Except that MAC spoofing is really easy, especially on a wifi network.

Bob_Bobber0

10-24-2011, 09:12 AM

Ah, I need to learn how to do that.

amaff

10-24-2011, 09:22 AM

:facepalm: that wasn't the point of me saying that! It was only to show the inherent flaw in physical address based security.

Funny side-storry: So, you know how MAC addresses are supposed to be unique? Like, in the world, unique? They're not. We once got a case of NICs for some machines we'd built out when I was working in the computer labs @ Mercer, and when we got around to putting them on the network, they went bat-sh** bonkers. Turns out: the entire case of NICs had the same MAC address, and as they were on the same network, they just kept kicking each other off. We called the company to complain. Their initial reaction was "that is literally impossible." Uh-huh.

Bob_Bobber0

10-24-2011, 09:36 AM

:facepalm: that wasn't the point of me saying that! It was only to show the inherent flaw in physical address based security.

Don't worry, its not like I'm actually doing it, just cool to know how it works and how to do it ;)

Now I know how to better secure my own wireless network..when I get one...if I get one...alright forget the beer, no wait, the hookers...awww screw the whole thing!

That's pretty nuts about the MAC addresses though.

epilonious

10-24-2011, 02:42 PM

My Latest Understanding of Wireless internet security effectiveness:

Have everyone logging in using wireless have to log in to the VPN in order to be able to touch anything >>>> WPA2 with mac address filtering > WPA2 >>>> WEP > Open Network.

The problem with all wireless networking is that you are essentially putting an Ethernet port on the outside of the building that anyone walking by can plug into. So if you don't treat it like that, you have a massive security hole.

For most homes... Just use WPA2 with your home phone number as the password. It's secure enough to keep the neighborhood ne'er-do-wells and drive-bys from trying to use your internet connection... but easy enough to remember and tell visitors so you don't have to go rummaging for the post-its and router passwords whenever someone new comes to the house.

If you are a business and you don't have the wireless modem behind some sort of "Visitor Internet" firewall and/or VPN tunnel enforcer, you should have a long talk with your IT guy...

amaff

10-24-2011, 02:52 PM

at my work we have a non-broadcasting wifi network that you then need a VPN tunnel to get into. That helps too :)

Bob_Bobber0

10-24-2011, 02:55 PM

For most homes... Just use WPA2 with your home phone number as the password. It's secure enough to keep the neighborhood ne'er-do-wells and drive-bys from trying to use your internet connection... but easy enough to remember and tell visitors so you don't have to go rummaging for the post-its and router passwords whenever someone new comes to the house.

Which is exactly why people have developed WPA2 "dictionary" files that can be programmed with your area code and then it generates all possible phone numbers to use against the network to attempt to crack it.

Stumbled across one of these this weekend. Statistics say something like 50% of all people use their phone number as the password.

amaff

10-24-2011, 03:00 PM

Which is exactly why people have developed WPA2 "dictionary" files that can be programmed with your area code and then it generates all possible phone numbers to use against the network to attempt to crack it.

Stumbled across one of these this weekend. Statistics say something like 50% of all people use their phone number as the password.

damn, really? That's nuts. The thought never even crossed my mind :lol:

subspeed6

10-24-2011, 07:20 PM

Yeah but it comes down to this....

If you are a scab trying to steal someone's WiFi internet, which would you want to choose:

1.) An easy target which has little to no security?
2.) Someone who has WPA2/WEP, MAC addy filtering, assigned IP addresses, etc?
Either way, it is still illegal and trying to say it isn't is delusional.

I am a complete nut when it comes to my internet and security. I have a DMZ with firewalls and routing tables, I run MAC address filtering, I have assigned IP addresses, I run stupidly strong passwords, and I don't broadcast my SSID.

91LudeSiT

10-25-2011, 06:16 AM

Wireless security is not fool-proof, and will never be 100% secure. You can take steps that will make it take so long for a hacker to gain access that they will give up or ignore your network.

I have a modified linksys router with a broadcast range of roughly a city block, because of this I have taken extra precaution to secure my network.

I use a layered defense approach, at the very first layer I've hidden the SSID. This will deter the most basic hackers, and the average script kiddie. You would have to know I have a wireless network, or have special tools to find it.

The next layer is to use decent encryption, this is an important step that most folks forget or ignore. Never use WEP encryption, it was created by network engineers and not cryptographers. It is very weak and even strong keys can be easily broken. I personally use WPA2 with an AES key, this is 256-bit encryption. Anything else is not 802.11n spec and will reduce your network speeds. To keep this from being broken the idea is to use a good key. I use a passphrase of 6 randomly chosen dictionary words; which works out to 88-bits of entropy. The would take a person with an average home computer (capable of about 1000 guesses/sec) on the order of about 1.8 quadrillion years to crack/guess my key. If you had access to a supercomputing cluster it might only take around 6-12 months.

The final layer is to use a mac filter, my router won't even allow a client with an unknown mac to authenticate on the wireless. This prevents people from gaining access and finding a mac list to clone. They would basically have to walk into my home and grab a mac address from one of my devices.

This is not 100% secure, but I am confident it will deter even the most dedicated internet thieves.

Long story short, they should fire their IT guy. You have also left a huge trail of breadcrumbs. Any decent router is going to keep logs and these could be used to find you. Not that they will, but I'm sure the feds wouldn't take kindly to the excuse "man I just wanna watch netflix".

amaff

10-25-2011, 07:18 AM

The final layer is to use a mac filter, my router won't even allow a client with an unknown mac to authenticate on the wireless. This prevents people from gaining access and finding a mac list to clone. They would basically have to walk into my home and grab a mac address from one of my devices.

This is not 100% secure

Wireless packet sniffer and a little coding can get you the MAC addresses...

But again, that is a boat-load of trouble for someone to go through to hack into someone's home network. Generally speaking? No one's going to go through the effort. But if it's a corporate network...

91LudeSiT

10-25-2011, 07:23 AM

Wireless packet sniffer and a little coding can get you the MAC addresses...

But again, that is a boat-load of trouble for someone to go through to hack into someone's home network. Generally speaking? No one's going to go through the effort. But if it's a corporate network...

Sure, but then you still have to be able to crack my key, not an easy task for your average internet thief. Which is pretty much all a home user needs to worry about.

Don't get me started on corporate wireless, the amount of security needed is insane. The VPN tunnel with an open network approach is the way to go.

amaff

10-25-2011, 07:28 AM

Sure, but then you still have to be able to crack my key, not an easy task for your average internet thief. Which is pretty much all a home user needs to worry about.

Definitely.

Don't get me started on corporate wireless, the amount of security needed is insane. The VPN tunnel with an open network approach is the way to go.

Also definitely.

Bob_Bobber0

10-25-2011, 08:31 AM

I feel like if you just hardwire everything you are fine..

Shortround

10-25-2011, 01:43 PM

I'm going to get my wife in on this she just took a semester on this crap as she is emergency management major...

780racer

10-26-2011, 02:52 AM

I feel like if you just hardwire everything you are fine..

No, hardwired with VPN, mac authentication, and the network contacting The IT guy to give privileges would be more secure, but honestly the only secure network is one that has no access......

Also I would like to add, a WPA2 password is worth nothing if everyone or someone leaks the password.

But honestly you should not have to worry about someone trying to hack your wireless, because there are still tons of unsecured networks that require no brain power to connect to. and if they are driving around they can always stop at a mcdonalds, or someone else that does NOT turn off the Ap's so NOT chick fil A....damn those calls. Anyways, i do recommend also looking into re flashing your router with some customer files, makes it work just as well as most 800 dollar Gateways that company's pay tons for support and setup.

Hope my knowledge can help you learn that networking sucks....... completely.

blk95r

10-26-2011, 04:22 AM

C'mon everyone knows the best way to secure your home network is to name it: "FBI Surveillance Van #3". Much better than naming it a bogus car dealer. ;-)

subspeed6

10-26-2011, 02:56 PM

Hahaha.

Despite everything, can we all agree this is rather immoral and definitely illegal? Also, if you have your wireless unprotected then you can't complain if someone leeches off you.

Yes?

91LudeSiT

10-27-2011, 06:36 AM

C'mon everyone knows the best way to secure your home network is to name it: "FBI Surveillance Van #3". Much better than naming it a bogus car dealer. ;-)

The SSID on mine is "I've Seen You Naked".

Hahaha.

Despite everything, can we all agree this is rather immoral and definitely illegal? Also, if you have your wireless unprotected then you can't complain if someone leeches off you.

Yes?

Leeching off an unprotected wireless is still a crime... However intentionally thwarting measures used to protect a network and gain access, that is a horse of a different color.

miatasaint

10-27-2011, 07:22 AM

So, is hacking through wifi a pretty common thing in the real world? Ive always wondered.

Stealth97

10-27-2011, 12:02 PM

Leeching off an unprotected wireless is still a crime...

Which I strongly disagree with, especially when someone is invading the personal airspace of your home with it.

amaff

10-27-2011, 12:13 PM

Which I strongly disagree with, especially when someone is invading the personal airspace of your home with it.

So, hypothetical. One of your neighbors has a party at his space, and to make room in his drive way, parks his car so that it's well out of the way but technically on your land. Your neighbor happens to be a space cadet and leaves it unlocked with the keys in it. But it's on your land. Are you allowed to take a trip to Florida with it? Even if you're back before he notices it was missing? (it was one hell of a party, obv...)

91LudeSiT

10-27-2011, 12:17 PM

Which I strongly disagree with, especially when someone is invading the personal airspace of your home with it.

O.C.G.A. § 16-9-93(b) - Computer Trespass: Using a computer with knowledge that such use is without authority and with the intention of: (1) deleting or in any way removing, either temporarily or permanently, any computer data (2) obstructing, interrupting, or in any way interfering with the use of a computer program or data (3) Altering, damaging, or in any way causing the malfunction of a computer.
O.C.G.A. § 16-9-93(c) - Computer Invasion of Privacy: Any person who uses a computer with the intention of examining any employment, medical, salary, credit, or any other financial or personal data relating to any other person with knowledge that such examination is without authority shall be guilty of computer invasion of privacy, but it could also be a violation of O.C.G.A. § 16-9-93(a) Computer Theft, which provides: “Any person who uses a computer with knowledge that such use is without authority and with the intention of: (1) taking or appropriating any property of another, whether or not with the intention of depriving the owner of possession, or (2) obtaining property by deceitful means of artful practice."

Agree or disagree it is still a crime.

Stealth97

10-27-2011, 12:27 PM

Agree or disagree it is still a crime.

of course.

Bob_Bobber0

10-28-2011, 10:07 AM

Agree or disagree it is still a crime.

The way that those laws read it sounds like merely browsing the internet isn't a crime? Its when you actually access their files over the internet or change stuff on their computer or go snooping around that a crime is committed?

Kinda like looking into the car parked on your lot and checking out all the cool features, but once you start taking parts and switching stuff around its a crime? Lol

metalman

10-28-2011, 10:25 AM

If you function by principle rather than nitpicking at 'rules' none of this is rocket science.

You are allowed to look at your neighbors and their stuff, at least whats visible from your property or the street. You are not allowed to enter their property, go in their house, or help yourself to their stuff. To do so violates their rights, as they begin where your's end.

Hacking a network is entering someones property.
Using their internet is stealing their stuff.

/the end.

Bob_Bobber0

10-28-2011, 10:30 AM

Not denying its probably morally objectionable, just pointing out the phrase "AND with the intention of." Seems interesting.

Jack-MX5ATLanta.com

10-28-2011, 10:31 AM

+1 Kurt. It's ****ing simple, your title is "hacking wifi networks" for ****s sake. That sounds nice and legal right?

This is illegal behaviour and I don't know if there's a rule against this on here specifically or not but I've had enough of this ridiculous thread popping up now.

Bob_Bobber0

10-28-2011, 10:38 AM

I don't see a problem with a discussion about the laws and the general issues of unsecured wireless networks..?

I rolled a stop sign last night, that's illegal, what we can't talk about it?

91LudeSiT

10-28-2011, 05:43 PM

I don't see a problem with a discussion about the laws and the general issues of unsecured wireless networks..?

I rolled a stop sign last night, that's illegal, what we can't talk about it?

Thats a bit different... Admitting to the commission of a felony crime, and potentially commission of a federal crime depending on what you were poking around in, on a public forum is not a bright idea.

metalman

10-28-2011, 05:44 PM

I rolled a stop sign last night, that's illegal, what we can't talk about it?

Well I suppose you could...or any number of other thread topics such as:

Wacking off in knickers stolen from Victoria Secret

Peeping at the guy next to you at public urinals

Shoplifting summer sausages in your pants at Publix

Defecating in the courthouse square

Breaking antennas off parked cars

Shoving dull needles in kittens eyes

etc etc etc

but......you may just get a free ticket to Banville aka Tibbettown.
Or, as Jzilla says....you might end up welcomed as a citizen in Bandavia.

Bob_Bobber0

10-28-2011, 06:24 PM

Twas dumb. I experimented. Its over. Lets move on.

hahaha that sounds a bit like Kurts post above.

now that I think about it, it would be nice to have this thread removed lol.

subspeed6

10-28-2011, 07:22 PM

it would be nice to have this thread removed lol.

So this means you realized your mistake despite saying you did nothing illegal?

Although, I like Metalman's idea.. I am going to attempt to snag some VS knickers and then do what he said. It sounds like a challenge.

Bob_Bobber0

10-28-2011, 07:45 PM

I sincerely acknowledge the arrogance of my ways in believing that actively attempting to thwart another's private network was not a serious offense both in the moral and political aspect.

I hereby submit my apology to this community insofar as what I have suggested has been obscene and atrocious in both character and content. I shamefully request that this not stain my already tarnished reputation upon this site as a fellow miata owner.

I promise to never engage in such actions again.

Cheers.

Dr.Drew

10-28-2011, 07:56 PM

I'll agree with Jack on this one. You did something stupid, you apologized, now lets all move on.

Allow me to start, here's some wicked underboob. Everyone look at the underboob and focus on ignoring this thread and forgiving Bob.

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/sideboob-underboob-15.jpg?w=500

Mmm, underboob. I ****ing love underboob.

Beastinthebushes

10-28-2011, 08:24 PM

Even she is looking at her underboob

subspeed6

10-28-2011, 09:17 PM

I sincerely acknowledge the arrogance of my ways in believing that actively attempting to thwart another's private network was not a serious offense both in the moral and legal aspect.

I hereby submit my apology to this community insofar as what I have suggested has been obscene and atrocious in both character and content. I shamefully request that this not stain my already tarnished reputation upon this site as a fellow miata owner.

I promise to never engage in such actions again.

Cheers.

I don't accept this as it seems to be forced from you based upon the response of the people here. I have corrected your apology in the one aspect where you seem to forgot the one thing most important.

While the program you have wandered upon may have nice uses for network admins in a defensive manor, it seems you have used it for not so legal and immoral uses.

If you really want to "watch Netflix" from what you have said, just buy your own internet or spend some time in free WiFi place like Starbucks, McDonalds, etc....